P: There are practices to delve deep. With eyes and ears closed, you can delve
deep inwardly. Is there any validity to delving?
K: Yes, definitely. What you call ‘delving in’ is to shut your eyes, to shut your
ears. In that state is there a delving or is there a cessation of all movement, which
appears as though you were delving in? When you really close your eyes and
ears, there is no movement within or without as desire demanding fulfilment,
with all its frustration. When that does take place, there is complete quietness.
The moment you use the word ‘delving in’, a duality is implied.
P: You hear that horn. To you is there no noise at all in it?
K: No.
P: It is quite extraordinary. To you there is no noise. When you close your ears,
is there no inner sound, separate from you? We hear an inner sound. Do you not
hear it?
K: (Krishnamurti closes his eyes and ears) No. But one must be clear. When the
eyes are closed, one generally sees spots. If one observes those spots, they
disappear.
P: Is there not an expansion, a contraction?
K: Nothing. When I close my eyes, there is absolutely no movement of any kind.
P: That means your whole consciousness is different. When I close my eyes,
there are so many patterns. To you there is no movement of sound or pattern.
K: That is why I want to go into this question of knowledge. This person has not
read the Yoga-sūtras and the religious books, and to him there is only a complete
emptiness.
P: It is not because he has not read any religious books.
K: There is no interference of knowledge.
P: The same phenomenon will not happen to anyone who is ignorant of religious
literature. It cannot happen to a communist.
K: It is knowledge as pattern that interferes. The pattern is created by knowledge,
experience. When there is no retention of knowledge, what happens? There is
absolute quietness, no movement of the eyes, of the ears and of desire. Why do
you make this out to be something special? The man who is caught in
association, in ideas, in thought, in pattern, does not have an empty mind.