demo

41

Which is why Cohen’s courtroom turn
could be the start of a consequential,
even historic, period in American
politics. More details of his allegations
against Trump will surely emerge. A
second Manafort trial on charges he
acted as an unregistered foreign agent
will get under way in September. And
eventually Mueller will likely issue
a report detailing everything he has
found about Russia’s 2016 meddling
and whether the Trump campaign was
involved. At which point Democrats
who might control one or both chambers
on Capitol Hill could be expected to
look beyond their own investigations
to impeachment. —With reporting by
ALANA ABRAMSON, HALEY SWEETLAND
EDWARDS and KATIE REILLY/NEW
YORK;andMOLLY BALL, RYAN TEAGUE
BECKWITH, PHILIP ELLIOTTandABBY
VESOULIS/ WASHINGTON □

INTERVIEW

WHAT NIXON LAWYER JOHN

DEAN LEARNED FROM HISTORY

BY OLIVIA B. WAXMAN

PUNDITS LIKE TO MAKEcomparisons

between President Donald Trump and

President Richard Nixon, but those links

aren’t usually drawn by Trump himself. An

exception came on Aug. 19 when Trump

tweeted, in light of the news that White

House counsel Don McGahn had met

with Robert Mueller’s team, that McGahn

wasn’t a “John Dean type ‘RAT.’” Dean,

as Nixon’s White House counsel, played

a key role—by deciding to cooperate with

prosecutors—in the events leading up to

that President’s resignation. Speaking

to TIME on Aug. 21, Dean said he wished

he’d had an example he could turn to

when he was deciding

what to do back then.

Now he’s playing that

very role—for Michael

Cohen. Dean spoke to

TIME about the news and

what he thinks of his own

return to headlines.

What’s your reaction to

Cohen’s statement that

payments he arranged

during the Trump

campaign were made

“at the direction of the

candidate”?He has

pretty much identiied

the President as a criminal. He said he

did it at his behest. If [Trump] weren’t

President, he probably would be named

as a co-conspirator and indicted.

What does that mean for the

comparisons to Watergate?It’s

conspiracy. Watergate was a conspiracy.

This is a campaign conspiracy.

What’s your reaction to the Manafort

trial verdict?It’s not surprising. It’s clear

that the jury went carefully through the

case. It’s an opening shot by the special

counsel. It really sets up the situation

that Manafort was in.

What did you think of Trump calling

you a rat for your role in exposing the

Watergate cover-up?That just didn’t

surprise me at all. Every day, he throws

invective at somebody. I was trying

to be the honest guy and stop all this

nonsense of spinning and lying and

twisting history. I was more distressed

or annoyed by him calling the true public

servants who have taken salary cuts to

go to work for Bob Mueller “thugs.”

You’ve recently found yourself back in

the news for something that happened

decades ago. How does it feel to have

gone viral?It’s not surprising. It’s a

culmination of what’s been going on. I

didn’t know when Michael Cohen was

going to plead or work a deal out, but

I knew it was imminent

because I was talking to his

lawyer Lanny Davis, whom I

know personally, and he was

picking my brain as to what

had happened and how

it had all happened back

during Watergate. I wasn’t

giving legal advice, just

historical information.

What do you think will

happen next? It’s not clear,

unlike Watergate, how the

public is going to become

educated about all this.

There is really no equivalent

to the Senate Watergate Committee.

The Republicans just won’t set it up.

They don’t want to inform the public

about this. So as long as they control the

House and Senate, they’re not going to.

Let’s say the House goes Democratic

after the election—I suspect we will

learn [about it] through a combination of

oversight committees.

Is there anything you learned during

Watergate that would be useful for

people to keep in mind as the news

develops?It’s early. Watergate went on

for years, and it takes time for the public

to one, learn; two, even get interested

in learning; and three, react. That’s one

of the things that Watergate certainly

teaches us. What’s very useful and what

got me through the whole matter was my

belief that the truth ultimately prevails.

The July 9, 1973

cover of TIME