2020-02-29 New Zealand Listener

FEBRUARY 29 2020 LISTENER 29

RJ: Yes.

DS: So you would agree that they might

find that offensive to hear the suggestion ...

RJ: Oh, God. I stated a fact. It is a dying

language, admitted by Government propo-

nents last week who are making no headway.

Which shows there’s common sense out

there. But I consistently said ... that if people

want to do it, that’s their choice. Don’t make

it compulsory. And I’ve held that view since

I first started secondary school at 13 when

all New Zealand public state-school kids had

to learn French. I refused to. I don’t want to

learn French.

DS: You call it a waste of education.

RJ: Of course it is. The human brain has

infinite capacity to absorb stuff. What kids

don’t have is infinite time. They should be

more selective of what they use their study

time for.

DS: You then relate it to law students

having to learn Latin, “a language with no

connection to New Zealand”. Do you see

that that might be provocative?

RJ: Oh, God. Provocative to who? Dead

Romans?

DS: I’m not asking whether you think

people should feel provoked, I’m asking

whether in your columns in which you

appear to enjoy provoking, you realise that

this would provoke.

RJ: Basically, you’re saying, if I wrote, “the

cat sat on the mat”, would that be provoca-

tive. I tried it once, and it was.

Jones said he had never once said that

people should not learn Māori and his

objection was only to compulsion. “I have

always argued simply, as I started arguing

when I was 13 and refused to learn French,

‘I don’t want to learn French’.”

Salmon put to Jones another column

quote in which Jones had written, “If some-

one’s interested, by all means learn Māori.

So, too, with an endless list of activities from

stamp collecting to line dancing. Each to

their own, but let’s not have compulsion

based on an ill-considered romanticism.”

Salmon asked if Jones agreed that

“describing learning te reo as, quote, ‘ill-

considered romanticism’, will offend a

number of people?”

RJ: Och, well, as I say, all sorts of things

offend people. We live in an age of offence-

taking as we read about all the time.

DS: We also live in an age, though, where

there’s a fairly strong position in Govern-

ment policy and in culture to reinforce and

learn te reo and where it is not considered –

RJ: Which, by their own admission last

week, has failed ...

DS: And which is not considered an ill-

considered romanticism by most Māori

people. Do you agree?

RJ: No, I don’t think most Māori people

don’t agree with that at all. I think they’d

probably agree with me, I think. If you want

NE

W

SH

UB

Opposite: Renae

Maihi. This page: Jones

and Maihi coming

and going from the

Wellington High Court.