19which sub- category it fi ts into above: that which
seeks to spread Islamism.
These are only my defi nitions; in my life working
in this fi eld I have yet to come across any that seem
more accurate. Others will have their own.Harris So an Islamist attempts to impose his version
of Islam on the rest of society, and a jihadist is an
Islamist who attempts to do so by force.
Nawaz That’s right.
Harris That clarifi cation is very helpful.
Nawaz Let’s move now to your concentric circles. At
the center of the inner circle at the moment is the
Islamic State, which has come to eclipse al- Qaeda.
Its members are what I call global jihadists. Then
you have more regional jihadists. They, too, use
force to spread Islamism, but they tend to re-
strict themselves to both a geographic and a demo-
graphic focus, and they are less unhinged. Hamas
and Hizbollah are in this category. Jihadists are,
by anyone’s account, a minority of Muslims in
the world, but they are the most or ga nized and have
the most power, and they dominate the discourse
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