Dumbo Feather – February 2019

I supposeeverycorruptpowerseekstodivide

andconquerthethingthatit’stryingtohave

powerover.Sowhenyoulookatthehistory

ofcolonisation,partofthemacabregenius

ofcolonisationistoseek—andoftenitwas

successful—togetpeopletodotheirownself-

hatredforthemselvesorbetweenthemselvesby

dividingpeopleup.SoyoulookathowtheBelgians

dividedtheHutuandtheTutsisinRwandaand

Burundi and you see that thesewereutterlyarbitrarydistinctionsthatlettheactualcorrupt

power continue on unnoticed whilesomethingterriblewasgoingon.AndI thinksomeof

the misogyny and homophobiathatyoufindhousedsometimesinveryconservativepoints

of view can create victims who hatethemselvessomuchyoudon’tevenneedpoliticalor

religious leaders to say abhorrentthings,’causeyou’resayingittoyourself.It’sbeenputinto

your DNA. I suppose in that contexttherewaspartofmethatwasculturallyconditioned,

so I don’t blame myself for it. I dorecogniseI wascomplicitinit,butI can’timaginehow

I could not have been. When yougrowuphearing,youknow,thatyou’reanintrinsicmoral

disorder or an abomination or disgusting,allthesevariousphrases,wellthenofcourse

I sought to rid myself of those things.

I love the word “maithiúnas.”’CauseI thinkforgivenesscomesladenwithsomuch

complexity. So to be able to lookatmyfrightenedselfandtogoodmyself,ithasthe

capacity of some kind of lullaby.Youcansaytoyourself,“It’sokay,howcouldyouhave

known any different? And aren’twegladwegotoutoftherealive?Andwhatcanwedoto

make sure other people do?” It createsa conversationinyourself.

Yeah. Becauseforgivenessdoescarrytheideaofwrongdoingand

blame. “Youshouldhaveknownbetter.”Thosethings.I don’tlookat

it that way.I mean,I do.I aminneedofgooding[laughs].Allofour

pasts arewherewe’vebeenterribletoourselves.

Yeah.Somymum’ssisterMaryis

deaf.AndI grewuparounda lotof

deafpeople.Wedidn’thavemuch

moneyinthehouseandmymother

usedtosneakusintothefreehour

for deaf people in the local swimmingpool.Myauntyusedtopretendthatwewereherdeaf

children [laughs]. So...! [laughs].Therewasalwaysa lotofdeafpeopleinmylife.AndI love

language. I was always fascinatedtobeina roomwheretherewasa lotofsigngoingon.SoI

got a sign language dictionary andtaughtmyselfhowtospellinIrishsignlanguage.Andin

Irish sign language, the sign forfearisyoutakeyourfivefingers,orevenmaybeyourten

fingers, and you put them againstyourchestina kindofslightlyrapidtouchingmotion.Like

your chest is fluttering. The signforcouragedoesthatflutteringandthenmovesyourhands

It occurs to me that from that part of the journeyoutof
fear there’s some self-forgiveness involved. I heardyou
talking with Krista Tippett about the exorcisms andthe
sense that at one level you must have been compliant
to actually enter into it. Which I found a bit confronting
in itself. But was part of that journey also the capacityto
look at what had happened and forgive yourself? Likeit’s
so understandable to be in fear in that circumstance.

Oh how beautiful.

That is a most wonderful way of

sitting with it. It doesn’t carry all of the

implied judgement that sometimes

the word “forgiveness” can.

There’s a beautiful sentence in your book, InTheShelter:FindingA

Home In The World. You said that courage comesfromthesameplace

as fear. And so where there is fear there is the possibilityofcourage.And

then you talk about sign language for fear andcourage,whichI loved.

The word in Irish forforgivenessis“maithiúnas”

and that is the sameword forgood.Soin Irish,

to forgive yourself isto “good”yourself.

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